- I could do a whole 1 hour lecture about why I disagree with him, but here is a simple explanation. - The Moon, The Sun, The Artic, The Maldives, The Gambia, The Fens, The Himalayas, The Kop, The Crimea ..etc. etc.

- It is that it's nothing to do with Ukraine, but is to do with the way English works. English "is a "stupid language" with no control authority nor logical system. You can try to tell me there are grammar rules but actually the truth is there is no correct format, rather things become accepted when enough people use them and it is perfectly possible for 2 different options to be accepted at the same time.

- Generally places have "The" if a thing like "Island", "reef", "Republic", "State" is part of their name, but also 1 in 2000 places have "The" for no obvious reason. Note how rivers and seas always have "The" yet lakes and mountains don't. (The Black Sea, but just Baikal !)

.. see "stupid language", but enjoy your time in Ukraine never"the"less

Do I have a right to tell people how to say the name of "their" country ? I think some Ukrainian politicians have a campaign for the "The" to be dropped, .... but they have no right to to tell people how to speak English. English language is a wild animal that just evolves on it's own.

- Anyway I tell students English language is not a set of rules, but better learned by copying ... so don't look for "rules" in English just open your mouth and speak.

Let me know if you want that 1 hour lecture

- This kind of question arises quite often in radio programmes about the use of English like the excellent BBC Radio 4 programme "Word of Mouth" http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006qtnz/episodes/2008

- Again and again listeners write in with questions like "I hear some people say X and other people say Y which is correct" and again and again the experts brought on explain that in cases where 2 or 3 alternatives are in common use.. it is not correct to say that one way is wrong, but rather both X and Y are acceptable.

- So that's why when I read "the Ukraine is wrong", I knew that was a very questionable statement.

- It's not a big deal, but I am sure in an entrance exam for Cambridge or oxford University you wouldn't be marked wrong if you used ""The Ukraine" Note how the BBC itself very frequently uses "The Ukraine" as does the Cambridge University website ..seems the majority of websites use "The Ukraine"

- Grammar rules : I am aware that many learners and teachers which to regard English as a fixed mathematical structure and it gives them great comfort to be able to go their big grammar book and check on page 3467 what the correct "usage" is, but this is not the normal way linguists regard the English language. (check in a grammar book what the word "cool" meant 40 years ago and then try to tell learners that unless they use it an way to mean cold or make cold then "they are wrong" ....no language is more fluid)

- I could you a list of 200 place names which use "the" some of them will also be commonly used without the "the". Yes we could dig deep in the history and grammar books in search of a "correct reason" for the "the", but it's a waste of time when you can tell from the weight of common use.

- Yes I understand that politicians have changed the name in Ukrainian to reflect that it is not part of the Soviet Union, but the use in other languages is irellevant to what we say in English ... Quite simply no politician can make rules about English although they can express a preference.

- I found this : "However, the media in Russia mostly use traditional na Ukraine, in some cases defending it as correct usage and discounting the Ukrainian government's authority over the Russian language." www.answerbag.com/q_view/50763 I think this is what is behind the strong argument. (there is also an argument in Russian here http://www.efl.ru/forum/threads/24256/all/)

"The Gambia remains an anomally" ..No if you look you will find another 100 anomolies I named some in my original quick list the Congo, the Lebanon etc

- I am not saying that English has no rules at all, rather that 1. the rules are not fixed in concrete and 2. especially in the case where there are 2 popular usages : then we can't say one is the rule and the other isn't. I could express English as a list of 20,000 grammar "rules" and I am aware many countries teach languages by focusing on grammar, but it is accepted that for English the communicative approach is much more effective as students speak automatically without the hinderance of having to think about "grammar rules" ..Most native speakers are not aware of of 95% of grammar rules, but neverless will guess the "correct use" of even made up words automatically.

- from the "Concise Dictionary of World Place-Names" : the Ukraine (and now as a state the ‘the’ is omitted), and is derived from the Russian okraina ‘(land) on the edge’, thus ‘borderland’ from u ‘beside’ and kray ‘edge’ to denote the territory between the open steppes of Russia and Asia to the east etc.etc.

- Using "the", I think also allows to imagine a country as it's full borders including areas which maybe under the control of other nations.

- I don't believe that the word "the Ukraine" was not used in English before Soviet times, Wikipedia seems quite clear on this.

- of course Wikipedia has a whole page on the matter .. I should have looked there first http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Name_of_Ukraine " Ukraine without the the, and this has become the more common styling."

- I will continue to use the first word that comes out of my mouth until someone gives me a good reason otherwise.

- Me I don't care what you call the country of my birth I am a citizen of the world. Note that if you ask 1000 Americans how to say my name "Stew" 999 will give a different pronounciation to the one I most other people use ..no big deal it doesn't bother me ..it's only a name.

- I see I made a mistake hen I saw the phrase "Ukraine without "the" is the correct" I thought he/she meant in a grammatically correct Sense, but I understand that they meant in a Politically correct sense. I still say one can't change the conventions of standard English use by making prouncements.

- What they could have said is this ... Not part of "The" Soviets anymore

-The official name of the country is now Ukraine not "The Ukraine". The government decided this in year ???? to make an emphatic statement that Ukraine is not part of The Russian or Soviet empire anymore. This originates mainly from the way the media in Russia mostly use traditional "na Ukraine", which in Russian language implies Ukraine is not a in a country in it's right. Many patriotic Ukranians believe that using "the" in in English is the same thing. So if you want to do business with those more patriotic parties then make sure your business card doesn't have the word "The Ukraine" on it.

------ I don't like the way people generalise about whole nations saying "the Americans" implying citizens all feel the same, when you travel you realise the world is techicolor not just black and white stereotypes, so I won't say "the ukrainians feel" as I am certain not 100% of citizens agree. Remember only a few years ago the majority of the Eastern populatin wanted to break away and rejoin Russia. Actually the 3rd person I asked said ..."I think Ukraine is part of Russia ... the old Soviet times were better .. I put "The Ukraine" on my business card .. and my friends were shocked"

- the 2nd person said ... "politicians here are all thieves I don't care what the name is"

- the 1st person said ... "politicians here are all thieves I don't care what the name is ... I'm going to emmigrate"" request that people